Episode Seven: Healing Is Not Self Punishment

Why do so many of us treat healing like another thing we need to get right?

Why do we speak to ourselves in ways we would never speak to someone we love? Why do we believe growth should feel hard all the time? And why does the process of becoming healthier so often become another source of pressure?

In Episode 7 of Becoming the Sanctuary, Kelley explores a pattern she still catches herself falling into more often than she'd like to admit: turning healing into a punishment program.

Many of us say we want to grow. We say we want to heal. We say we want to become healthier, happier, calmer, more regulated, and more present versions of ourselves. But somewhere along the way, something subtle begins to happen. Healing quietly transforms into another impossible standard we place on ourselves.

Every flaw must be corrected. Every mistake must be analyzed. Every trigger must be fixed. Every emotion must be managed perfectly. Every setback becomes evidence that we're doing something wrong.

And before we know it, healing becomes another way of telling ourselves we aren't enough yet.

This episode explores a difficult but important question: what if many of us aren't actually healing? What if we're trying to perfect ourselves instead?

Because those are two very different things.

Throughout this conversation, Kelley dives into perfectionism, shame, self-awareness, accountability, and the exhausting pressure many people place on themselves to get life right all the time. She explores how the same voice that tells us to grow is often the very same voice telling us we're constantly falling short.

One of the central themes of this episode is understanding the difference between self-awareness and self-criticism.

Self-awareness helps us understand ourselves.

Self-criticism attacks us.

Self-awareness creates curiosity.

Self-criticism creates shame.

Self-awareness says, "What can I learn from this?"

Self-criticism says, "You should have known better."

Many people spend years believing those two voices are the same when, in reality, they are completely different experiences.

This episode also explores how healing itself has become entangled with achievement culture. We live in a world that constantly encourages us to optimize every aspect of our lives. Improve your morning routine. Improve your sleep. Improve your productivity. Improve your finances. Improve your relationships. Improve your body. Improve your nervous system. Improve your mindset.

While none of those things are inherently bad, they can quietly create an underlying message that many people begin to believe without ever questioning it:

Who you are today isn't enough.

That message is exhausting.

Because if every day becomes another opportunity to become someone better, when do we allow ourselves to simply be human? When do we stop treating ourselves like unfinished projects? When do we stop acting as though life is a race toward some perfected future version of ourselves?

Kelley reflects on how these patterns have shown up in her own life while building Thrivewell Hub, creating workshops, writing books, launching a podcast, transitioning into a new full-time position, and continuing her own healing journey at the same time.

She shares something that many people quietly experience: perfectionism doesn't disappear simply because we become more self-aware.

In many ways, self-awareness can actually strengthen perfectionism if compassion isn't introduced alongside it.

The more aware we become, the more opportunities we can find to criticize ourselves. The more we learn, the more we can convince ourselves that we should already know better. The more we grow, the more we can believe we should be further along than we are.

That cycle can become endless if we don't consciously interrupt it.

This conversation also explores the reality that many people have unintentionally turned healing into another full-time job. They consume books, podcasts, social media content, courses, certifications, and endless advice about becoming better versions of themselves. While growth is beautiful, there is a point where self-improvement can quietly become self-rejection.

When every day becomes another opportunity to fix yourself, it's easy to forget that you were never a problem to solve in the first place.

The episode also dives deeply into shame and why it is such a poor teacher.

Many people unknowingly use shame as motivation. They believe that if they are hard enough on themselves, they'll finally change. If they criticize themselves enough, they'll finally become disciplined. If they punish themselves enough, they'll finally become successful.

But sustainable change is rarely built through fear.

Long-term healing is rarely built through criticism.

And emotional safety matters far more than many people realize.

Kelley also breaks down the difference between guilt and shame.

Guilt says, "I made a mistake."

Shame says, "I am the mistake."

That distinction may sound simple, but it has profound implications for how we move through life.

Because mistakes are inevitable.

Being human is inevitable.

Imperfection is inevitable.

The goal is not to eliminate mistakes. The goal is to change our relationship with them.

This episode also redefines what compassion actually means. Many people misunderstand compassion as lowering standards, making excuses, or avoiding accountability altogether.

But compassion is none of those things.

Compassion is accountability without self-abandonment.

Compassion is honesty without cruelty.

Compassion is learning from mistakes without turning them into evidence that we're failing.

Compassion is responding instead of attacking.

Compassion is understanding that growth and grace can coexist.

Listeners are also invited to reflect on an important question:

Would you ever speak to someone you love the way you speak to yourself?

Would you talk to a child that way?

Would you talk to a friend that way?

Would you talk to someone actively trying to heal that way?

For many people, the answer is no.

Yet those same impossible standards are often turned inward every single day.

This conversation invites listeners to begin extending some of that same compassion back toward themselves. Not because life is easy. Not because accountability doesn't matter. But because healing was never supposed to become another war we fight against ourselves.

One of the deeper realizations woven throughout this episode is that many of us have become so accustomed to fixing ourselves that we've forgotten how to simply be with ourselves.

We've become incredibly skilled at identifying problems, but not always at acknowledging progress.

We've become incredibly skilled at correction, but not always at compassion.

We've become incredibly skilled at striving, but not always at allowing ourselves to feel proud.

And perhaps that's because modern life rarely celebrates progress. It celebrates outcomes. It celebrates arrival. It celebrates completion. Yet human beings are never truly finished. We are always evolving.

That means there may never be a moment when we suddenly arrive at some perfected version of ourselves.

There may never be a day when every trigger disappears, every emotion is regulated, every insecurity is gone, and every mistake stops happening.

And that's okay.

Because healing is not a destination.

Healing is a relationship.

Healing is a practice.

Healing is returning.

Returning to yourself after mistakes.

Returning to yourself after setbacks.

Returning to yourself after difficult seasons.

Returning to yourself after old patterns resurface.

Returning without shame.

Returning without abandoning yourself.

At its core, Healing Is Not Self Punishment is an invitation to stop making yourself the enemy.

It is a reminder that accountability and compassion can coexist. Growth and grace can coexist. Progress and imperfection can coexist. Healing and humanity can coexist.

Because maybe healing was never about becoming someone else.

Maybe it was never about becoming perfect.

Maybe it was about becoming kinder to the person who has been trying so hard all along.

Real healing asks something much harder than perfection.

It asks us to tell the truth about ourselves without abandoning ourselves in the process.

If you've ever felt like you're failing at healing, if you've ever turned personal growth into another impossible standard, if you've ever felt exhausted trying to become a better version of yourself, or if you've ever wondered why your own inner voice can sometimes be your harshest critic, this episode is for you.

Because perhaps the greatest act of healing isn't becoming a new person at all.

Perhaps it's learning to stop treating yourself like a problem to solve.

#BecomingTheSanctuary #ThrivewellEstate #HealingJourney #Perfectionism #SelfCompassion #EmotionalHealing #PersonalGrowth #MentalWellness #SelfAwareness #HealingPodcast #Mindfulness #Embodiment #InnerWork #AuthenticLiving #RecoveryJourney

Transcript

SPEAKER_00 0:09

Hello everybody, and welcome back to Becoming the Sanctuary. This is your first time here. My name is Kelly, founder of Thrive Well Estate and Thrive Well Hub, and this podcast is a space where we explore healing, embodiment, emotional awareness, nervous system regulation, creativity, human connection, and what it actually means to return to yourself while still living inside a very overwhelming world. As I've been preparing for today's episode, I've been thinking a lot about something that I still catch myself doing far more often than I'd like to admit. I'll make a mistake, I'll miss a detail, I'll say the wrong thing, I'll fall short of a goal I've created for myself. And almost instantly there is a voice that appears. Not a voice of curiosity, not a voice of compassion, but a voice of criticism. A voice that starts listing everything I should have done differently, everything that I should have known, and everything I should have gotten right. And the more I've reflected on it, the more I've realized that many of us approach healing the exact same way. We say we want to grow. We say we want to heal. We say we want to become healthier, happier, more present versions of ourselves. But somewhere along the way, many people begin treating healing like a punishment program. Like every flaw must be corrected, every mistake must be analyzed, every trigger must be fixed, and every emotion must be managed perfectly. And before they know it, healing becomes another way of telling themselves they aren't enough yet. I don't think that's healing. I think that's self-rejection wearing a healing costume. So today's episode is about perfectionism, shame, self-criticism, compassion, accountability, and why healing was never supposed to become another reason to be at war with yourself. All right. So as we talk about this first section of the podcast, um, you know, and and I'll say this every single time. I know that it can feel like sometimes a lot of this is repetitive, or it's like that we're standing on this fine line of balance, right? How do we how do we hold ourselves accountable and be self-aware? But how do we not let that go too far and and be too harsh on ourselves and and not show ourselves enough grace and really self-criticize? Um, and that's because everything we pretty much talk about is that fine line. I think that's being a human is is finding the balance in any aspect, you know, whether we're talking about the shadow and the light, um, or or self-awareness versus self-criticism. So I think the first thing that really started with me when I became um, well, when I started my healing journey was really becoming aware of patterns. Um not only patterns within myself, um, but patterns that I would see in the world, in the universe. Um you know, some of them you've heard you can hear them be called synchronicities or, you know, these I don't know if it would go into the serendipitous moments, but I really just started recognizing patterns. Patterns when I would slip backwards into an unhealed habit or version of myself, and then the patterns that I would see in the universe. Um, and I just started taking those as signs to dig a little bit deeper and work a little bit harder on myself. But what that can then lead to, and I definitely can relate with this, is overanalyzing every single behavior. You're you're constantly evaluating yourself, and you then turn growth or lack thereof into judgment. And think about that when you do that in your own life. Um, because I know for me, especially like this week, I I had a lot going on this week. Um, as you heard me talk about in my last episode, I've gotten a new job, and that's gonna be starting up in the next few weeks. So learning how to get myself ready for that and and make sure that I'm prepared to start that job. But also this week there was um the last day of school for my boyfriend's son. Um, it was also my boyfriend's birth birthday. We also have a big community event happening on Saturday here in town that I'm part of the planning committee for, and also um Father's Day on Sunday. So it was a lot, um, and it still is because as you'll hear this, I will have made it to the end of the work week in a sense that it will be Friday, but but I'm recording this um earlier in the week. Um, so so I'm right right smack in the middle of it. And I was on the phone this morning, and I was and I I did it. I I was doing the very thing that we're talking about in this podcast. I was really starting to be um have that self-criticism for myself that you know that I'm not doing the healthy habits that I want to do. I'm not, you know, taking care of myself the way that I want to take my care of myself. And I had I stopped myself mid-sentence though. And that's where I want to know, want you to know that is the most important. We're gonna slip, right? The ebbs and flows of life, we're gonna slip backwards, forwards, sideways, up, down, whichever. Um, but how quickly do we turn that around and bring it back to the healthy version of ourselves? And even though I started the conversation with criticizing myself about, you know, that I felt like I was really going backwards, it's it's no, having the self-awareness, but not hyper self-awareness. And we'll go over what the difference between that is, that this is a lot this week. And this is a week that I take it a day at a time, and I really prioritize what needs to happen this week and what can wait, what can I adjust to give myself more time, and understanding that getting through each day, um, and especially for myself, getting through each day sober and without beating myself up or really stretching myself too thin, you know, if you don't have an alcohol or an addiction problem, it's just that. Just getting through each day with being the best version of you can that of yourself that you can be in that moment doesn't mean perfection. Um, some days it looks like 100%, some days it looks like 25%, but both can be your best version of yourself that day. And it is just knowing that that is enough, that that is okay. And we don't have to say in these weeks, you know, where we have so much going on, because that's how life works. Sometimes we don't have a lot going on, and sometimes everything's coming at us from all angles. And it's it's allowing yourself to be in that without it turning into criticism. What what balls did you drop? What you know, where did you, where did you rest, where you should have been productive? And again, it can sound repetitive, but it it really is true because then what can happen is, and sorry if this episode, like I just said, I'm gonna give myself grace before I beat myself up over listening to this. I am tired. My brain, I've I've been nursing a uh wannabe migraine um for about three days now. Not about it has been three days. I know that for a fact. So I might be rambling a little bit more and might not make some sense. So I'm just saying that's for my overthinking self later on. Uh, future Kelly will thank me for saying that. So let's talk about what self-awareness is versus hyper self-awareness. So, I mean, we think of something that is a little bit more common heard is you can hear, um, and especially for women, it seems it can be a lot more prominent, is hyper-independence versus independence. Okay. And I'm just making that that example so that we can kind of relate it. So independence is is where you are independent, you you can get things done in your life, you show up for yourself, and you, you know, you pay your own bills and and you're independent, you are able to live life um without needing to depend on many others in everyday situations. But if you do have a week that's tough and is hard, or you're going through a season of your life that you do need help, you don't put a wall up there and make it so nobody can help you, or you never ask for help. So you you have that independence, but you know there's times where you're gonna need some help and you're okay with that. Hyperindependence is when you are independent and you never ask for help, you are determined to get things done by yourself. And if you do need help with something, it it's a negative, you you take it as a negative thing for yourself. And I was hyper-independent for a long time, and for me, it was really just and it was a lot more geared to towards um my past relationships where I just felt like I couldn't depend on anybody, so I became hyper-independent because I didn't want to be disappointed. So now if we we translate that into hyper self-awareness, right? So self-awareness is understanding where old habits or old patterns can slip in. Um and and you you see those. You you see those in yourself, and you know that you maybe it's an area of your life that you need to work a little bit harder on. But when it goes into hyper self-awareness, is that really is that criticism where you are just looking at every habit of yourself, you're looking at all these different patterns that keep popping up, you overanalyze the conversations that you've had with people, and and and you can almost become, I don't know, the the best way I can explain it is is it is debilitating. Um, you can almost become frozen. Because when you are that self-aware, right, that it hits an unhealthy place, you are afraid to move because you understand the ripple effect of all your decisions, right? Because we all we have all heard about it. We know we know that butterfly effect that you could turn left instead of right, and it can change everything. Well, this can almost happen within your healing journey as well, where you are super aware that every single thing that you are doing has some sort of consequence, but but it's not but when you enter that unhealthy version, then you're not allowing yourself to have grace that you that you don't, yes, be self-aware, but know that you are gonna move with the ebbs and flows of life. You're not always going to be in this perfect state. And when you are hyper self-aware, you you start searching for flaws, right? And and you start seeing, oh, I slept five minutes later than I wanted to. Well, maybe you couldn't fall asleep exactly where you wanted to. Um, and think about in your own life where that hyper self-awareness comes out, and really think about the difference, right? Where was I self-reflective versus self-attacking? Um, we want to have awareness, but awareness without compassion for yourself is where this hyper self-awareness comes in because you're not seeing the context of what you were going through, right? I like I said, I started doing it today when I was on the phone. I, you know, I was like, I need to be better, but I'm just looking at myself and not the situation that I'm in, not the time frame that I'm in. And that's where the voice in our head becomes very, very, very important, right? Because what is that voice saying to us? We have no problem. Well, not that we have no problem, but a lot of people I find show so much for comp compassion for everyone around themselves, right? And show grace and oh, they must have been having a bad day. I'm not gonna take it personally. But what about yourself, right? Why is it that that voice in our head, right? It when when we talk about awareness without compassion, what that equals out to be is that inner critic, just criticizing ourselves all the time. Because I promise you, and I probably will say it in every single episode, and it was something that I just will keep on repeating be perfection is not possible. Because even if we thought for one second that it could slightly become possible, think about the world that we're living in. There's so many variables. There's so many variables, and this thing that we carry around with us every single day, every single moment of every single day is our phone. Anybody can call us at any time and give us news that would completely change our healing journey, our life, the trajectory of where we're headed. So, to think that we need to be perfect and to start suffering from perfectionism and setting these impossible standards for ourselves, what do we think is going to happen? I have a friend that really helps me with that. And and I would really suggest that you start to get a tribe that really helps you understand how to have compassion with yourself and to set goals and standards that are realistic and achievable. Because if you don't and and you continue to just put these standards on yourself or expectations, your self-talk, it's not positive. It becomes negative. And then if we're in the habit of watching patterns, then we're we're either mentally or physically documenting that all of these mistakes that we're making, quote unquote mistakes that we're making, right? The the thing we said that we shouldn't have said, or the phone call we never got back to, or laying on the couch instead of instead of following through on a commitment, you know, because we just had a really, really long week and we weren't expecting that. We can take all those quote unquote mistakes and it becomes evidence, right? Evidence of the criticism that we're giving ourselves. But really, it comes down to a fear of failure and a fear of getting it wrong. And I am a big advocate that there is no such thing as failure. If you give up and you no longer try, right? And and you don't, you're not able to move with the pivots and the ebbs and flows of life, like fully giving up and not trying, that's failure. But to have a fear of failure, you know, if if you are compassionate with yourself, but you are accountable and you are self-aware, it's only lessons learned. Honestly, I think back on my life and and where I failed. Um, and the only places I really failed is like I said, is when when I gave up. But when I try my hardest and something's just not working out the way that I thought that it was going to, and I have to pivot or change plans, um, then then that's okay. That's just like I said, learning the lessons that life is is here to show us. But if we stay with the with the voice in our head being that inner critic, we just get lost in these shame cycles. I mean, think about it. Like we're we're so critical of ourselves and something that we didn't get right or what we thought we were supposed to get right. And then that just continues. We we are now shameful, right? That we're judging ourselves. And and through that, that shame, um, it reminds us of other moments in our life that we weren't good enough, or we weren't strong enough, or we weren't compassionate enough. And that's where a lot of these beliefs come from, um, and why so many people speak harshly to themselves. Because it's this cycle, it's this pattern, it's it's this repetitive voice in our head, and and a lot of people will will sit there and and label it. Um, I know that there's times where I'll try to put a label on myself to almost excuse the behavior, and it's just not true. I just have to be kinder. And like I said, it's a very, very, very difficult dance, the balance between the two, um, because we do have to be accountable and we do have to be aware. But like in anything, we just can't let that cross a line where it's becoming unhealthy. Um, and it's up to us to learn and to understand where that where that line and where that boundary is within ourselves. Because if we don't, um that's when healing becomes really just another project. Um, it's something else we're we're trying to do perfectly. Um I know I've talked about this before, but we can just start really consuming endless self-help content. And it really, like I said, it really can put you in this almost frozen state because you can continue to read the books and listen to the podcasts. And if you never embody that, right, and you just stay in your head, because that's really what this episode is is talking about, is is us staying in our head and just being really critical. Um then we get we get we get lost lost in that. Um sorry, hold on. I just kind of I I thought a sneeze was coming on and then it stopped. So now I've just kind of lost um lost where I was going. Okay, awareness. So when we uh stay there and we never embody it, because the more that we embody what we're reading and what we're understanding and what we're teaching ourselves to regulate or um just be a healthier, better version of ourselves, then we are able to kind of nip these in the bud and understand that these thoughts, the more you practice saying no, right, to this self-criticism, the same way you might tell somebody else to not talk to you like that, talk to yourself like that, saying, I'm not gonna, I'm not gonna talk to myself like that, I'm not gonna treat myself like that. This week I'm doing the very best that I can. And if I can't um do it up to the standards that I said I quote unquote should, um then I'm gonna show grace for myself and and just stop it, stop it before it goes into that criticism. And and also when it be can become another project too, is when we're trying to optimize every emotion, right? We're we're fixing ourselves constantly. And when I say trying to optimize every emotion is sadness, right? If all of a sudden you feel sad, because sometimes that just happens, we don't have to then go into every single layer in that moment to try and understand where the sadness is coming from and really optimize that emotion because sometimes that can just expand it because we might be sad that we can't figure out why we're sad. And this is it's a tough episode to explain because it's something that you really have to walk. Um and be because otherwise this this self-criticism that we're talking about versus the self-awareness, we start to treat growth really like a like a checklist. I experienced that like the last month or so, where I really the expectations I was putting on myself was that I should be far healthier, um, a more healed version of myself. And I was really feeling like I was behind. It it was almost like I was healthier six months ago, and I've opened a healing arts um space, and I feel like I'm behind. I feel like I've regressed. Well, have I regressed, or am I just carrying a lot more than than what I was six months ago?

unknown 21:59

Right.

SPEAKER_00 22:00

Am I responsible for more? And I don't mean just the business responsibilities, right? Of making sure I'm marketing myself right and and that I'm I'm going through my financials properly and I'm hitting each daily mark that I need to. No, I mean being a guide for others, you know, having my energy be exchanged with other people who walk in here and I'm being present and I'm listening. And that does take something out of you. And that's why understanding my own healing journey and not being critical of myself when things get a little bit harder is even more important. Because that is not something that I want to build a wall up against. I want to be human and I want to be more human. And sometimes that means, you know, being in more vulnerable positions, um, and really just really showing showing grace with yourself. Because another thing that we can do, um, which again, like I talked about before, being in the culture that we're in with social media, and especially with how trendy wellness has become, my God, can we compare healing journeys? You know, sometimes I'll I'll tell people how long I've really started my healing journey. And I criticize myself when I think about how long I've been working on it. And it's like, like I said, I feel like I've only just been getting started. And that's okay. I think there's a song, isn't there? Demi Lovato. Um, it's okay to not be okay. Not realizing that you're not okay and being okay with that is one of the biggest marks of that you are, in fact, on an amazing healing journey. Because when you realize about self-improvement, right? Because before it used to be we would be, well, I'll speak for myself, I'd be terrified at the idea of not being okay, being okay. Worse than that, people knowing that I'm not okay. Now, when I say to people, I'm not okay, and that's okay, I take you could hear it, I just said it, did it there. Like I take this very big exhale because it's just I'm giving myself that space to become okay and and not let this self-improvement that I'm trying to do become self-rejection. And think about in your own life where there's moments where it's become a project for you, right? I I know I kind of I don't want to say that I criticize, but I do a little bit of all these videos of people's morning routines, and they're filled with like 50 different steps, and they range from 4 a.m. to 8:30 a.m. And I don't know, it's just to and and if you have the ability to do that and do it well and and put it out there for the world to see, I'm I'm I'm really I'm not judging you specifically, I'm judging this expectation that has been put on society that if you're not having this wild morning routine um that's all about self-care and healing and and being present and but it's also you know when when it does become this type of project that we're talking about, then if we miss one part of it, that's the expectation and the standard we're putting on ourselves. So just recognize in your own self moments where you feel like you're behind. Why do you feel like you're behind? What are you looking at? Who are you talking to where you feel like you're behind? Because once you really start to understand what a healing journey is, and it's not something that I have fully understood, understand myself, right? I'm a human and I'm going through my own healing journey. Just because I've opened this space or half this podcast does not mean I'm an expert. You can listen to every single episode that I have so far, and everyone from here on out, you will hear that I am a student as well. I'm I'm still trying to understand this because it is hard. I will I will say that it is very hard to go through your healing journey and not compare and not feel like you're behind and not get into this state of fixing everything because the more we become aware, the more we see. But it's it's the compassion piece for ourselves and for others that we really need to take into account. And that's what keeps us on that very fine line of balance. Um, now for you know, my own perfectionism. I mean, for somebody who can feel at times like such a hot mess, the fact that I have this crazy amount of perfectionism in my own self is wild because there's days where um, you know, I I'll be fully honest, there's days I come here and I'm like, oh, I didn't shower. I didn't shower today. Like, how did I miss that? Right? How did I, but that's what being in this, we're using so much energy trying to be perfect or even trying to have our healing journey be the best possible journey it can be that we lose the basics. So I really on my healing journey from where I was before from now, like if I'm hydrating and I'm I'm present in my life and I'm brushing my teeth every morning and night, like sometimes that is enough. Um, and it's it's daily work. I work on my own perfectionism almost as much as I work on um my alcoholism, to be honest. Um and really, really just trying not to beat myself up about it. I remember, yeah, I mean, even within this podcast, I was gosh, the reason I needed to be perfect with the videos and and then judging myself of switching from having video podcasting to just audio. And then there was an episode I forgot to plug my microphone in. And and I'm not kidding, this had me laying awake at night. And it's like, how many people are listening to my podcast and a brand new one at that and criticizing me for that? They're not, and if they are, I'm not hearing them. So, but I mean, just in everything Thrive Well Hub, I needed it to be an immediate success. Um, just entrepreneurship in general. I've made some mistakes. Um, I've made some expensive mistakes. I've I haven't done the right research for certain things. Um, a big one I can tell you. I didn't know when you file for an LLC. I thought that was a one-time $500 charge. Turns out it's a yearly charge. Um, so that is now something that I know going forward. But there's no guidebook to this, there's no step-by-step process, right? It's all a learning curve. And you're expected to know it. But if we don't, that's okay. It's a learning curve. Because once we start putting pressure on ourselves to get everything right, and like you said, the fear of the mistakes, fear of judgment, um we're we're creating impossible standards. So we are gonna make mistakes. And if people judge me, I don't care. Like I really don't, because the right people in my life and who are in it for the right reasons, they're never gonna judge me. They're gonna support me and they're gonna help me understand how to avoid um something like that in the future. And the for the people who do judge, um, you know, judge a person, then they need to look in the mirror and understand where where are they coming from that they feel that it is okay to judge you without knowing who you are, what you're doing, or what you've done to even get to the point where you are. Um, so to have that fear of judgment, I've just learned, it doesn't matter. I the people who care about me and are in my corner for the right reasons. Um, I don't need to fear that. And I think a biggest, biggest thing that helps me is just really learning to laugh at yourself. And and the more that we can practice that, it grace comes right in behind it. Because was it silly to be a new business owner and not know that yes, that filing fee is once a year? Yeah, that's a big thing to miss. And something I will teach any other entrepreneur who's starting out, and I will never forget that now, you know. So it's learning to laugh at even the moments where it's like, wow, that's uh that's a big thing to miss. Um, that's something that if you don't pay that, could end up, I don't know if you end up with a sign on your front door, but who knows? Definitely not something I'm messing with. So I will um I will find that and make sure that gets paid, but but that's not the point, is to understand the logistics of where I'm at right now financially. It's just more to understand uh finding grace, finding grace, because I didn't know and I can't go back in time and beat myself up about it. Um and that's where I think will really lead us into to our next section here, where shame, it's just a terrible teacher, a terrible, terrible teacher because there is a difference. Um there's a difference between guilt and shame. And shame I feel is because the difference between it, somebody once told me what there was a specific difference um between guilt and shame. And I'm not gonna lie, my brain isn't working 110% right now. So I'm having to Google this if I'm being honest. Um Okay, guilt is guilt is about feeling bad for what you did, while shame is about feeling bad for who you are. There we go. That's the difference. So guilt is the action, shame is who you are, right? So, what I have to use as an example from this is anything that I really did while I was drinking, and I did a lot. Um, I I have a lot of amends to make and to still make. And understanding this difference is when I for it my very early sobriety is when I knew this difference. Um, because guilt, I would feel guilty for the actions, right? The times where I didn't show up, or the times where I let my emotions take over and I didn't say very nice things to whether it's my parents or or my brothers or my friends. Um but shame is really the person I was then. Shame, you know, feeling bad about who I was, and remembering that that's not truly who I was. Um it was it was the behaviors coming out, but I can still feel that now. So shame it holds us in the past. That's what I always found, is that when we look back, right, and it could be even something we did an hour ago. I used to be a sales manager, and I would tell people a lot that it's not how you react, it's how you recover, right? So if we're feeling shame for something we did in the past, but we've now we've apologized, we've made it right, we've we've done some sort of action to make amends to that person. Why is it that we should still carry that shame forward? That's not who you are. The second you hold yourself accountable and you're honest with yourself and you try to make amends where you were wrong, um, that shame should be let go, right? Like, because we're human and we're not gonna be perfect. And that's how this can really connect the perfectionism with shame. Because we want to talk about too what is the difference between accountability versus punishment. Accountability is being honest with yourself about what part did I have in creating the situation that I now feel shameful about. And I think with punishment is where you take that a step further, is you hold yourself accountable, um, but you don't forgive yourself. You don't release that from yourself, and and you feel like you need to punish yourself every single day for it. But I'll tell you, when healing comes from a place of shame, right? Uh it it very rarely creates growth. Because all you're doing is creating a fear-based motivation, right? Think about a management style. There's been enough studies that have happened now that when you have a fear-based management style, it doesn't work. People don't do their best work. So why would you think that within your own healing journey that that's the way to do it too? Because you're just putting your nervous system into override and your survival into override. And how do you ever then move into self-compassion? Because you're not going to be able to see it. So we really need to let that shame go. But if you are don't have the accountability, right? If if you don't look at it honestly and say, where was I wrong here? You're not going to be able to let that shame go. So this is where, again, another fine line, right? Because for us to have sustainable change and emotional safety, we have to learn how to take that step forward to be accountable for ourselves. You know, like I said, not how you react, how you recover. How do we hold ourselves accountable, make what was right, I mean, what was wrong right, and move forward and let that go and not carry it forward so that it stays stuck within ourselves, because that's how people often stay stuck, is because they're holding on to these emotions that they really should should release. Um, and the more that we understand ourselves, right, the more that we we look at what led us to to doing that action or behavior or saying that, that's where really our real healing comes. It comes through understanding. But I know we talk a lot too about um compassion, but what is it exactly, right? What compassion actually is? Compassion is not excuses, it's not avoidance, it's not lowering standards, it's it's accountability and kindness, whether that be accountability for ourselves, accountability for others, but it's also kindness, kindness with ourselves and kindness with others. And having that self-responsibility to hold ourselves accountable. I always say my biggest growth is what what the the accountability I have and then the change of behaviors I have while no one's watching. That's true accountability, where you when you don't get to show it off or people don't see it. How honest are you with yourself when nobody else is watching? And if you're lying to yourself, who's really losing there? You know, a lot of people can can have the consequences of your behaviors because you're not holding yourself accountable and you're projecting. Um, but but the person who who suffers the most is you. So, and like we said about mistakes, we really want to get to a place that we learn from our mistakes instead of judging ourselves for them or or criticizing ourselves and letting that perfectionism kick in. Because the more that we do that, the more that we learn to talk to ourselves differently. And that's where the emotional maturity starts to come in. And we start responding to ourselves and what our body needs instead of attacking it, and especially when it comes to our nervous system. And if we're we're in a world that, you know, people and things, they find reasons to to attack us for so many different reasons nowadays. Um, and the perfectionism is out there as a culture. So why would we do why would we add to that? Why would we sit there and tell ourselves we're not good enough or we're not strong enough or we're not smart enough, or you know, just really start to look at the way you treat the people that you love. Think about how we'd speak to a friend. How do we speak to a child? How we speak to someone who's healing, and think about the double standards that are there. How we talk to ourselves and how do we talk to the people that we love? Because we want to take that. This is what that the my nourish pillar is all about, right? In the thrival core philosophy, that nourish pillar. It's all about extending the compassion that we give to others and bringing it inward. And why this feels difficult is we are at a time in the world where this pendulum is starting to swing back, that we're not selfish and we're not only caring about ourselves, and we're trying to shift out of this um society that really treats productivity as what is equals worthiness. So if we start showing ourselves compassion, right, where we're in other generations, it was taught to like push through and and um you know have that chip on your shoulder, have that stiff stiff upper lip. That's why it's difficult because we're we're in a we're in a transition. Um because imperfection is part of growth. It's it's part of humanity, it's what makes us human. Because otherwise, what are we talking about? We're talking about robots, and I don't want to live in a world like that. But I think I have rambled more than enough for this episode, and um, but I think with the we always want to come back to the deeper realization, right? That healing is not self-punishment, growth is not self-rejection, mistakes are information. Healing is not perfection, healing is a relationship, it's understanding, it's practice, it's returning to ourselves over and over and over again. And I I learned this in early sobriety, and I have a sign somewhere in my house um that says it, but we want progress over perfection. We just want to be at least one percent better than we were yesterday. That's it, that's all we're asking for. Um, because everybody makes mistakes and everyone falls short sometimes. And we are all students who are always learning. And um be be patient with yourself because healing requires patience, it requires a lot of honesty, and it requires even more compassion. And once you get to the point that you know that growth and grace can coexist and you stop making yourself the enemy, sky's the limit. You're you're on it then. You're really gonna start to see the changes in yourself far more and far more growth than when you when you hold yourself on this this perfection standard. Um, because if healing requires you to hate yourself and to becoming someone better, that's not healing. Real healing asks something much, much harder. It asks us to tell the truth about ourselves without abandoning ourselves in the process. And I can tell you without a shadow of a doubt that this week is is a real test for me. Um, and I'm I'm doing it. It's not easy, but the compassion, having a reminding myself a lot of the compassion um to have with myself. But like I said, I think that's where we will wrap it up. I hope this episode made sense and I hope it was it's helping people. I want to thank you again as always for joining me here on Becoming the Sanctuary. I can't believe it, but next week I will be recording episode eight. Um so if you feel like this podcast is helpful and you think it could be helpful for others, please share, help us get um, you know, some some eyes on the podcast and and really get it out there to help people. And and I really hope that my authentic self and and how honest I am with myself, it it's helpful and it's it's showing through on this podcast. But until next week, um, next week we will be talking about how the body remembers everything. Um, and it doesn't have to be as scary as it sounds. But like I said, I think that'll wrap it up. I hope you have an amazing weekend. And if you're in the Whitensil area on Saturday, be sure to check out the sidewalk sale. There's gonna be a lot of small businesses, amazing vendors. Um, it's gonna be a really good time, family friendly, and the town's really just diving in. So um, but otherwise, uh, thank you for joining me, and I will see you next week.